Freight trams envisaged for Glasgow
 

Freight trams envisaged for Glasgow
http://www.railnews.co.uk/news/metro...r-glasgow.html

I have found a few pics of freight trams for you locojoe:

http://www.motat.org.nz/collections/...s/image006.jpg

http://images.derstandard.at/20050517/4w.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_hdch2vG_qks/Sq...ght%20Tram.png

http://www.thecollectormm.com.au/pri...zabeth1962.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...5/56/GTram.JPG

You get the idea.:D

Thanks for the photos SFE, Lets hope the Glascow tram frieght idea is a success.

Embracing green technology is one thing but making something as inflexible as this work in practice will take an Act of Parliament!!
There is now a growing feeling amongst Joe Public that this Carbon Reduction idea is just a revenue raising scheme for hard press Treasury's to profit from. I like to think that a common sense approach of using what have more sensibly and cutting out wasted energy will reduce our local tax charges in the long run. Things like having a tram system which can collect cart loads of waste or recycling in sidings for a big pickup and despatch to a huge central plant instead of small lorries running all over with multiple handling & long distance tipping journeys reduced. Where there are no trams then a system of multi-user wagons can be adopted on either Network Rail systems or private lines, even London Docklands could feature in the waste/recycling program.
Light railway lines need to be creeping out into more urban areas if we are to make the most of integrating this kind of operation for the sake of our childrens future! The bloody climate will just do as it pleases anyway, with or without our help.

I have always wanted to see freight trams on the metrolink.
In fact, a few months back I penned a letter suggesting this, but I got no reply. Some of the original trams still working are disgustingly vandalised. Often there is spit on the windows, torn seats and grafiti in a few. Why not convert these and order more series three trams here?

Back on the gneral topic, I think they have a frieght tram at Blackpool but not in service. Its a shame that they are going to modernise the line, poor taste if you ask me.:(

People should write to they're local MP's more when they make suggestions about improvements. They will reply and can often pass items on directly to people in high places.

Hmffff. No comment, other than to say that after MUCH consulting of local MPs, our town is now stuffed full of new housing estates & blocks of flats, local manufacturing has virtually been wiped out, unemployment is high, the scheme to build a light railway/tramway on the disused railway is to become a busway, our large screen cinema was demolished, an airfield is to be used for several thousand houses, our courtrooms have been closed, and our excellent hospital is to be closed shortly, being turned into yet more flats. And all this on a peninsula with a population of 77,000+. All these matters have been objected to, en masse, by the locals, all to absolutely no avail whatsoever. It should be pointed out that our MP is the 'King of the Duck Island', Peter Viggers. Even then, he HAS tried, bless his little webbed feet. So don't hold yer breath mate....:mad::mad:.

For a freight tram to work, you first need freight to carry.

Metrolink serves little use in this function since there isn't really anything that needs to get from A to B on the network except people.

but if there was a depot in say Prestwich or by the airport, the council could make all shops on the tram routes sign up to an aggreement that has all their stock delivered to the depot on the outskirts.

Considering delivery slots for every store vary greatly, this may help consolidate them into one manageable weekly or monthly payment :)

Gets all the HGVs off the road for those particular shops and out of the city centre. Deliveries can be made either early morning or in the evening, effectively making the city centre a controlled shopping area

I can't quite see HOW this would work. If companies' stock is delivered to a depot on the outskirts, as suggested, then I'm guessing that you mean that goods can then be transported via freight tram(s) to any number of shops etc throughout the city. I don't wish to put a damper on this, but there are only THE tram lines - what I mean is that a freight tram would have to be using the same track as the regular trams; if these have a regularity of, say every 10 minutes, that only gives a very short window for loading/unloading purposes, as the freight tram would be blocking the line used (most importantly) by the passenger trams. It would be a bit of a racetrack at best; after just ONE quick delivery, the passenger tram would be right behind the freight tram, which would have to get out of the way. How? This would require a huge number of passing loops, which would then themselves need to be made no parking areas, not to mention expensive to install. Even without loops, let's not forget that tramlines occupy one side of the road - if a tram was unloading, it would occupy that side of the road for a far greater period of time tha a tram stopping to pick up/set down passengers. Traffic would be held up throughout the route. It's simply not feasible. Sorry. :(

Trams do occupy parts of the road, but the point of trams is to get people off the roads so problem solved.

Just think it through SFE, Dave Rowland has it exactly right.

Passing loops seem to be the right way to go. Look at the Altrincham line, it used to be four tracks to it would require little work to install here.
Using parking spaces will discourage the use of cars in the city.

They work in other places obviously proven is some of the pics I provided to there is not any real reason why ir should not work.
With signalling improvements you can have a higher frequnecy of trams.
One option is to link a freight and passenger tram and detach them when needed.

and....

make deliveries first thing in the morning and/or at night when frequency is less

Although

most shops want deliveries round the back don't they? :( maybe not such a good plan after all

aaah, but, it could also depend on the stock used for it.

have a depot, loading pallets onto the specially designed wagon with a motorised offload system.

It would make sure that the shop owners are there for the delivery every time as the freight tram would be timetabled

What about the Pic Vic tunnel?
They did build it, but filled it in. Why not dig it out and let the shops get freight from down there. Sounds expensive.

Well, you've answered your own question there...

This cournty built an Empire that spanned a quarter of the globe and in the process built 100s of thousands of miles of railways around the world. This is fairly cheap and easy compared to that.

I think SFE is living in the wrong era. Anyone got a time machine ?:D

That was back in history, when this country was wealthy, and we led the world in technology and manufacturing. Now there is no Empire, we're nothing more than a banana republic without bananas, manufacturing here is all but finished. Haven't you noticed that almost everything new on our railways comes from somewhere else? As for 'using parking spaces will discourage the use of cars in the city' - it will also discourage customers; in a lot of cases, some customers only need to pop into a shop for a couple of minutes. These customers don't want to be paying extortionate parking rates for two hours/whatever's the minimum, if they only need to be there for a few minutes. Ask any shop owners where parking restrictions have been implemented. Businesses have folded because of this. And, if there are areas in the city which are no-go zones for cars, then those cars do not go away, they're just somewhere else in the city. And what happens if/when the recipient of any delivered goods cannot be, for any reason (perhaps having been held up by a freight tram waiting for another recipient to arrive?) in the right place at the right time? Life is NOT clockwork - 'life is', as they say, 'what happens when you're making other plans.' This plan will NOT work. There are far too many ifs and buts; it would make things even worse, if you ask me. If towns & cities had been originally planned and built with all this planned beforehand, then it might have some chance of being viable. Not now though. :(:):confused:

Hang on a bit, Piccadilly to Victoria tunnel? I've never heard of that before when was it built and why was it never used?

:DOK a few things.
England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Island, Gibraltar, The Falklands, South Sandwhich Islands, South Shetlands, Cayman Islands, British Virgin Islands, Pitcairn Islands, South Georgia Islands, British Indian Ocean territory, Tristan da Cunha, Saint helena, Ascension Island, Akrotiri & Dhekelia, Burmuda, Montserrat, Anguilla, Turk and Caicos Islands, The Cjannel Islands and of course British Antarctic territory.
Sound like empire to you? Does to me.:D

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picc-Vic_tunnel
Thats the project!

Sounds more like Great Britain and Northern Ireland and a list of Overseas Dependent Territories to me. And the Picc-Vic link clearly states that the tunnel was abandoned at the planning stage.

Really? I thought they started.
Oh well.

Overseas dependent territories? Empire? Difference apart from spelling?

It might be an idea to read an article if you're going to rely on it for facts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British...as_territories

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Empire

Never let it be said that SFE would let the lack of facts influence his opinion.:D

A bit more on the PiccVic line here http://www.metromapsoftheworld.com/PipeDreams/PiccVic/

Seems that a start was made........:eek::confused:

Regards, 62440.:D

Its a shame a city the size of Manchester has not developed an underground system combined with the Mainline workings and tramways (a bit like Rome where it becomes a cross rail through route with interconnecting lines serving other outlying areas. Helps keep the roads clearer for all the tourists visiting the many attractions. If there are secret tunnels already in place then maybe SFE can go explore and we promise to let him out eventually!

Thanks for clearing up the tale about the Picc - Vic tunnel, but I guess nowadays there would be little need as the Metrolink serves a similar purpose very well (abet a little slow) between the two main stations...........

Victoria is no longer a main station. Its a commuter station now, but I think that could soon change as Piccy is full to bursting!:D

Lots of tunnel's under Manchester..........

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...._tunnel_vision

There ARE photos of the underground platforms below the Arndale Centre.

There is a website called Urban Exploration - http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/

I will try find the photo from the guys who managed to get down there, but they explore all sorts of abandoned, unused, or never used tunnels, installations etc.

Sorry to go off topic but guys, seriously, check this;

http://i876.photobucket.com/albums/a...n/_MG_3285.jpg

Why is the cab of 142 059 just lying under Victoria station next to the river irk? How did it get there? What happened to it?

Why is there lightning streaking across the picture - is it a ghost??

Slow shutter speed; Someone moving about holding a torch?

Regards, 62440.

Yeah, there's no light down there, it's uninhabited, so you have to "paint" the room with a torch using a very slow shutter speed.

Still, quite weird 142 059 survives in some form, in a totally random location too! How did they even get it down there, the mind boggles.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/3587523711/

The answer to the question about the 142 cab lies in one of the comments of this photo..........It was going to form part of a driving simulator

Hmm, interesting.

You'd think you would save the bits that would actually be useful in a simulator though, ie, the actual cab, rather than the outer shell which you don't even need in a simulator.

yeah, like the control panel! ;)

Quite cool. I've seen something similar from other countries in Western Europe.
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Alexandra
Rail cargo transportation