Locomotives, electric and diesel trains 1520-mm gauge.

[Poezdnik]

Hello Steve,
Thank you for your attention!
On photo, the D1-001 railcar of rare device. It do transport a manager of the Donets Railway.

[Bob_Sinclair]

Hi All!

I am new here and wanted to know more about the batteries on electric trains, what type they are ( lead acid or nicad) how big are they? do most electric trains use the same type or are there lots of different ones?

I may seem like a strange request but it's something i find interesting so any and all information would be great.

Bob

[pre65]

I don't know, but lead acid and Nicad are old technology these days.

Do you mean traction batteries ?

[Bob_Sinclair]

Originally Posted by pre65

I don't know, but lead acid and Nicad are old technology these days.

Do you mean traction batteries ?

Hi,

Lead acid and NiCad are very much still an active and used battery, my understanding from researching online is that most electric trains use them for initial power/ stand by power.

I just didn't know exactly which ones do and manufacturers etc.

Thanks for the response, it's good to see that people are helpful here and dont just ignore posts.

[Beeyar Wunby]

Originally Posted by Bob_Sinclair

Hi,

Lead acid and NiCad are very much still an active and used battery, my understanding from researching online is that most electric trains use them for initial power/ stand

Hi Bob.

Really? What are your sources? I suspect you may have been looking at heritage traction.

I don't quite understand what you mean by "initial power, standby power". Presumably you're referring to the standard 'Auxilliary system' of 120 volts dc that all diesel and electric traction units in the UK have? A generator for diesels/ or converter for electrics supplies this voltage and the batteries are connected in parallel. If the converter stops (usually because traction current is interrupted), the batteries continue to supply 120v for a limited period. But this does not feed the traction motors!

In the majority of cases, batteries are not usually used for traction on mainline units, and are only the sole form of power in an emergency (to supply low level stuff like emergency saloon lighting, head/tail lights, and cab radios).

There are some prototype units that use batts for traction, and the new Heath-Robinson 'hybrid' units can travel a short distance on batteries, but most electric trains need to be connected continuously to either turd rail 750v DC or 25kv ac overhead traction current to function. Air is the lifeblood of every train, and air compressors are usually supplied from traction current, NOT batteries. So normal trains don't sit on 'batteries only' as they will lose their air, and the brakes will eventually fail to work.

AFAIAA all modern traction has used (at least) NiMH batteries for quite some time. From my experience, certainly the Bombardier & Siemens units, and the ubiquitous class 66 locos do.

HTH, BW

[Bob_Sinclair]

Hi Beeyar,

I have recently been privileged enough to be up close and personal with a few 350 Siemens electric trains (inside battery trays, these are NiCad batteries) and was advised by them that the batteries are used when not connected to the overhead line to get them going and shut off once in motion and connected to the overhead line, I am talking here of course soley about electric trains not diesel.

The battery is used for a very short period of time, which i suppose would contribute to their long life.

I have little knowledge/experience of trains and my latest experience has sparked an interest hence my question.

Bob

[pre65]

Interesting. I'm really surprised if NiCad batteries are being used.

The toxicity of cadmium and the problems with anything other than full cycle working (memory effect) made NiMH batteries a much better alternative .

But, I suppose, industrial sized wet NiCad batteries are another matter.

[Bob_Sinclair]

Originally Posted by pre65

Interesting. I'm really surprised if NiCad batteries are being used.

You guys will have waaaaaaaaaaay more knowledge than me about trains, is the 350 series an old build?

What do they use instead on modern electric trains? this is really interesting.

Bob

[Beeyar Wunby]

Hi again Bob

Well everyday is a school day, as they say.

You're absolutely right, and I googooed this linky....https://www.railwaygazette.com/uk/ba.../47363.article

As you say, they're doing the 'Flex' thing and moving the units around on their batteries. On a personal note, this makes me really get hot under the collar.

How typically British to throw money into researching a bodge when we should be spending it on fixing the problem - making the UK fully wired. There are several 'hybrid' projects running which are soaklng up £millions. The UK government has ordered hybrid trains for several routes and dodged the issue. Nice work if it's your company getting the action.

Most western European countries electrified after WW2. Here we are 75 years later still procrastinating. Not really surprising, just very disappointing.

Grrrrr,

Cheers BW.

[Bob_Sinclair]

Originally Posted by Beeyar Wunby

Hi again Bob

Well everyday is a school day, as they say.

You're absolutely right, and I googooed this linky....https://www.railwaygazette.com/uk/ba.../47363.article

As you say, they're doing the 'Flex' thing and moving the units around on their batteries. On a personal note, this makes me really get hot under the collar.

How typically British to throw money into researching a bodge when we should be spending it on fixing the problem - making the UK fully wired. There are several 'hybrid' projects running which are soaklng up £millions. The UK government has ordered hybrid trains for several routes and dodged the issue. Nice work if it's your company getting the action.

Most western European countries electrified after WW2. Here we are 75 years later still procrastinating. Not really surprising, just very disappointing.

Grrrrr,

Cheers BW.

Completely agree that we are totally behind the curve...... by a country mile!

Seeing as you are shocked at this application, i take it this isn't the norm for electric locomotives?

Bob